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Missing notes?



 
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CosmicScherzo
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Joined: 29 Apr 2014
Posts: 6

PostPosted: Thu Nov 18, 2021 8:43 am    Post subject: Missing notes? Reply with quote

So I've been having a problem for the past several months. My double F (three lager lines and a space) simply will not come out. The E below and G above are two of the most resonant notes on the horn. The F# isn't a sweet spot, but it'll speak. But that F just won't happen. It's not weak or out of tune or anything; it just doesn't seem to exist. I just move straight from the partial below to above and back.

I've had a reasonable amount of ownership of that note in the past, and on this same equipment, so it's not just some physical anomaly of the horn. Has anyone dealt with this kind of thing before? If so, did you find anything that helps? I actually need that note in my tool bag.

Thanks.
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trickg
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Joined: 02 Jan 2002
Posts: 5675
Location: Glen Burnie, Maryland

PostPosted: Thu Nov 18, 2021 8:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't venture into that register much these days, but years ago when I was doing Latin band, the interesting phenomenon for me with the equipment I was using at the time - a LB Bach Strad/25 bell and a Schilke 14A4a mouthpiece - is that if I was hitting the E, I had a hard time getting the F to speak, but if I was hitting the F, then for some reason I had a hard time getting the E to speak. I could never seem to be able to get in the center of each note during the same playing session.

That probably doesn't help, but it's an anecdote about my own experiences with it.
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Patrick Gleason
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"95% of the average 'weekend warrior's' problems will be solved by an additional 30 minutes of insightful practice." - PLP
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JayKosta
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Joined: 24 Dec 2018
Posts: 3275
Location: Endwell NY USA

PostPosted: Thu Nov 18, 2021 8:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Try various different valve combos - in that range there are many that can work.
And one of those combos (tubing path and length) might just happen to work better than others.
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Most Important Note ? - the next one !
KNOW (see) what the next note is BEFORE you have to play it.
PLAY the next note 'on time' and 'in rhythm'.
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Andy Cooper
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Joined: 15 Nov 2001
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Location: Terre Haute, IN USA

PostPosted: Thu Nov 18, 2021 1:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Has anything at all changed with your horn, mouthpiece, or you in the past few months?

Change in water key corks, springs, valve guides, up and down stroke felts? Dented mpc shank - any thing that would change your mpc gap? Dental work etc. ?
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trumpetjordy
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Joined: 04 Nov 2021
Posts: 20

PostPosted: Thu Nov 18, 2021 2:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jay said it right fyi but here's a little way you might go about diagnosing the problem further: simplify everything/ boil it down to first principles i.e. forget about valves, scales, and arpeggios for a second. Now that your horn is a natural trumpet and we're only diagnosing the mechanical aspect of your playing, chances are we'll be able to see the issue more clearly and hopefully find a fix much faster:) I usually refer to this as the overtone exercise:

#1 Play a C in the staff quietly, now compress like you normally would in your Colin, Smith, or Bai Lin flexibilities and slur upward slowly. Allow each note in the overtone series to lock into place. Don't force the timing or tuning, but rather just observe how your horn/ mouthpiece decides to slot each note. Let the horn play how it wants to be played...

#2 Always start on that C in the staff so we can eliminate any chance of an anxiety driven upper reg start/ chop manipulation. Play the exercise and allow yourself to glide all the way up to that high G an octave and a half above. Save most of your air for the top of the phrase. Don't think about the F. Just focus on playing quietly up the OT series from C to high G. Now ask yourself, did the F come out? If it did then keep doing the exercise, rest, play, rest play... until the F always comes out. Then do what Jay said and find the fingering that slots the note best with best relative tuning.

#3 If #2 didn't work then you might try adjusting your gap with the old scotch tape trick just to see if it is a gap problem.

#4 If still nothing works then I would try the exercise with a different mouthpiece. One that's a slight different size or brand but still quite close to what your are used to. Try the exercise on a few different pieces if need be. This will tell you if the mouthpiece part of the equation is to blame. Remember there are always three variables in the trumpet playing equation- player, mouthpiece, horn and there needs to be a balance between all three.

#5 It's not the mouthpiece or anything else so far? Test a few different horns. Play the exercise and see if the mechanical setup of your horn is to blame.

#6 It's NONE OF THESE THINGS?? If you had to go this far then it's probably you the player (I absolutely do not mean this as an insult) especially if a fellow player can play high F's on your horn without issue. So here the question becomes~ did you get braces? a tooth removed? did you change your embouchure? get a new tongue? (ha ha!) We know it's not a range issue for you Cosmic because you can play the high G. High F is a tricky note for many players. The mathematics of the OT series naturally plays out so that this note is out of tune and a small slot, open notes being easier for everybody etc...

Ok I hope this helps, and I hope you can fix by #2 not #6! May the chops be with you Cosmic!
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