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GR Beta Testing Results


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Which GR Rim tested best during the GR Beta Tests?
Red
48%
 48%  [ 18 ]
Yellow
16%
 16%  [ 6 ]
Blue
35%
 35%  [ 13 ]
Total Votes : 37

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B. Scriver
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PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2009 5:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The post above by Pat reminds me to let you all know that Alex Yates is at the ITG and she is available for mini GR Consults!

Brian Scriver
www.grmouthpieces.com
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Trptbenge
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PostPosted: Mon May 25, 2009 4:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I finished the testing today and enjoyed the process. I ended up testing three horns and a friend, who also plays a GR, went through the test.

My three horns were an LA Benge 3X, a Kanstul 1503 and a 1931 Olds French Model. I already play a GR66M so I was anxious to test all three rims.

On all three horns the Red consistently responded quickest for me and the Yellow took the longest to respond with some airballs. My mouthpiece was second to the Red in both test 1 & 2. My mouthpiece was first in the low slurs and the blue was second. My mouthpiece finished second to the Blue and Red in Tests 4 & 5. When the testing was done My mouthpiece and Red were tied for the best on the Benge and My mouthpiece finished first on the Kanstul and Olds with the Red a close second. The blue was very close behind on all the horns. The Yellow seemed to do well at loud volumes but it did not work well for me at softer volumes and ws well behind in a point system I set up.

After I finished the GR tests I played a couple of more extreme and higher intervals from "The Art of Trumpet Playing". The results were similar. I also played some tunes from a Jazz book - Lazy River, Night in Tunisa & When I fall in love and the Red seemed to have a little more energy to the sound - though my mouthpiece and the Blue mouthpiece sounded fine.

The Yellow felt the best, though it performed the worst. it also felt the largest. One night when I was tired and my lips felt swollen it seemed to improve - probably something to do with lip engagement. The Red felt the smallest and the blue and my mouthpiece in between - but close to the Red.

I am glad I had an opportunity to be a part of the test and I am anxious to hear more about the mouthpieces from GR & Bri. I am also glad, though not surprised, that my mouthpiece did well. Everytime I play I am always amazed by how well it performs for me. I have so much more confidence then I have ever had. When I start to play I know that the note is there. Thanks again Gr & Bri!

Mike
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_Daff
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PostPosted: Mon May 25, 2009 6:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hey Mike!

I suppose the assumption and the bases for these comparisons, and for the consultation/fittings would be that acclimation to a new/different mouthpiece is somewhat instantaneous. I suppose I could buy into that with reasonable conviction since I find it relatively easy to move between (at least similar) mp's, but the multitude of variables and factors, including a longer acclimation time, are vast. For example, how would the change in cup volume and/or backbore, alpha angle, and diameter affect how we respond to these same three rim profiles?

Having played GR's for 5-6 years, (way too many of them ), I'm curious to see what there is to learn from the comparisons and wonder if I'd come up with the same results after experimenting with the three of them for several weeks.
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Trptbenge
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PostPosted: Mon May 25, 2009 7:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Since I already play a GR that I bought after going through a consultation made a difference. I definitely found it easy to use any of the three - especially the Red and Blue. Unfortunately, the testing guidelines we agreed to give us only three days to test them but you really don't even need that. I tested the horn I use the most (an LA Benge 3X) twice and came up with basically the same result. This testing was pretty simple and there was no need to continue my experimentation.

After my consult with Alexa my playing on the GR66M just has gotten better and better. My endurance, intonation and confidence continues to improve. Since I have found the right mouthpiece I have no desire to experiment. I have gotten rid of my other mouthpieces. I have found that if you are sticking with a horn finding the right GR mouthpiece can be pretty simple. Of course, providing there are no gap issues on the horn.

It was fun to participate in the test. It also has been interesting how different people react to the rims. My buddy who came over liked the feel of the Yellow, like I did, but the blue worked the best for him. He had bought a GR66Z without going through a consult and it finished next to last in the evaluation.

Mike
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wilcox96
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PostPosted: Tue May 26, 2009 9:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
"_Daff"]
I suppose the assumption and the bases for these comparisons, and for the consultation/fittings would be that acclimation to a new/different mouthpiece is somewhat instantaneous. I suppose I could buy into that with reasonable conviction since I find it relatively easy to move between (at least similar) mp's, but the multitude of variables and factors, including a longer acclimation time, are vast. For example, how would the change in cup volume and/or backbore, alpha angle, and diameter affect how we respond to these same three rim profiles?


Several comments above are interesting to me...so, in the spirit of conversation...I'll say a few things.

First, I don't know so much about whether there is instant acclimation to a mpc - per se. I mean...others have said this same thing - where they have actually gotten better over time with their mpc. I find this to be true for me as well. I think we can have a general idea about some things (feel, etc) fairly quickly...but I do think you can grow into (for lack of a better term) a mpc....especially if it's one you have that fairly instant gratification with. Not always the case...(like, if a mpc feels/sounds really good at first...but you fudge out on it halfway thru a gig....or a tune! hahaha...)...

As for your notion about how the rims would work for someone on other cups, etc...this really hits on it for me. The cups/etc on the test mpcs were exponentially deeper than I use. I've been wondering, ever since, how I would react to "any" of them on my current cup(s). ?

All I know is, I am getting more and more anxious to know the results of all this. The "reveal". You all hurry up a test!! ha. It has been pretty cool to read what everyone has done and experienced though.
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mattdalton
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PostPosted: Tue May 26, 2009 9:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Red tested best for me, followed by yellow, then blue.

While the point of the tests were not for each player to find his/her match, I was secretly hoping that one of the three would be a great mouthpiece for my Bb trumpet. It didn't happen in this case. I have been playing a 65C* on my C trumpet since December following a consultation with Alex Yates, and that experience has helped me know the difference between being close and actually achieving a great match. For my Bb trumpet, the red piece was close and better than the moutpiece I am currently using for it, but not quite there. On some other trip I will have to find a way to work in a consultation using my Bb trumpet.

Like almost everyone else who has posted on their test results, I found the red to feel the smallest and yellow to feel the biggest. I am one who notices differences mostly in the position of the high point on the rim, and the three were noticeably different in that regard. The red rim's sharper bite was noticeable as well, and while it seemed to approach the point of not being comfortable, in the end it didn't bother me and seemed to have performance benefits.

Based on the feel of my 65C* compared to the blue rim, I won't bet money on Taylor's theory that the blue rim is really the GR standard rim. But I will also acknowledge that in the past I have perceived a difference in rim feel with the same rim on different cups. In this case the 65C* and the blue rim have similar alpha angles and different volumes...you never know. The blue rim actually felt a little bigger to me than the 65C*. It did okay on breath attacks, but finished futher back in other tests for me. It sort of makes me wish I had a standard-rim 65M for comparison.

I got the mouthpieces on Wednesday and tested Wednesday night, Thursday night, Friday night, then Saturday morning. Thursday's test results didn't match Wednesday's very well; blue fared far better on Wednesday than it did Thursday. I started to wonder if I was hearing different things, having an off day, or if it was just the 10 hour work day, getting home to take care of things and get kids to bed, then finally getting to practice (I'm sure many of you know that story well). Whatever it was, for the Friday and Saturday tests I decided to turn on the recorder and just play. Listening to the playback instead of trying to evaluate as I played worked so much better. The results became more consistent and I could listen more objectively. I'd recommend the record and playback approach to anyone doing these tests.

I am grateful for the opportunity to participate in the testing. It was interesting and educational, if nothing else, but I hope that my results and those of the other testers will be useful to Gary and Brian. Best wishes to everyone involved!
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Trptbenge
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PostPosted: Wed May 27, 2009 4:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Matt, I agree. I recorded myself with my Zoom H4. This allowed me to hear what I was playing from the other end of the horn and concentrate more on playing the different tests. I was able to concentrate more on the feel when I was playing because I knew I could play the recording back. On test #2 I could have sworn that there was very little difference between the mouthpieces. When I played the recording back I realized it was close but there were more differences then I first thought.

I recommend to anyone still on the list to test to record yourself if possible. It does help. That is why the GR consultation is beneficial because you have someone else listen to you while you are playing. Our perceptions from the mouthpiece end of the horn are not always entirely accurate.

As far as the mouthpiece rims go I would guess that the difference is the location of the high point on the rim - with the Red being the closest to the cup and the Yellow being the closest to the outside of the rim. This would explain the difference in how large they feel. Of course, this will affect the alpha angle, chop support, etc. This is just supposition on my part and I may be totally off base. I am anxious to hear what the real differences are.

Mike
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wilcox96
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PostPosted: Wed May 27, 2009 7:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

mattdalton wrote:
Like almost everyone else who has posted on their test results, I found the red to feel the smallest and yellow to feel the biggest.


First...Matt...another terrific review. I am identifying with many things each tester is saying. I don't know if I'm as sensitive - or realize the things you & Mike mention...like high points in the mpc.. Yes, I feel very similar variances as many have indicated. However, to recognize that equates to where the high point of a rim is...well, that is interesting to me. I'm sure you all are correct. Although I've certainly tried a zillion mpcs over my life...I never thought about it in those terms...so... You all are stating this very well.

The above quote... (largest to smallest)... I actually felt like the Blue seemed the smallest...followed by the Red...then the Yellow as largest. As I stated earlier.... the Blue felt like it kept the chops out of the cup the most (giving the perception of it being "smaller")...I about fell into the Yellow cup (perception of larger)...and the Red seemed a good balance of all. ??

I've read some say they felt the Red had an inner sharpness...but that was appealing to me, since I prefer strong, distinct attacks. It was still a very comfortable rim. The cushion was great.

Having only the Standard rim on any of my GR pieces...I not only don't think any of these test pieces is the Standard (because they didn't feel like my current pieces...regardless of cup/bb variances vs the test pieces), but I also hope I am right about that! ha. I sure want to believe that the rim I felt best on is something different - and would order it on both my cup/bb combos immediately.
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B. Scriver
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PostPosted: Fri May 29, 2009 5:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here's a new twist to those who have yet to test the GR Mouthpieces. I have added a new layover of the Beta Test Rims to the GR website. Check this out: http://grmouthpieces.com/layovers.htm
You will see the link on the layovers page.

Now let's see if this sways any of the testers. I have a theory that if we have in our minds what we perceive we need, we can easily manipulate the chops to change test results. That is why we originally labelled them with colors as opposed to model numbers. The true reveal is coming soon!

Brian Scriver
www.grmouthpieces.com
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Bugle Boy
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PostPosted: Fri May 29, 2009 7:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I completed my testing today.

I performed the testing with my B-Flat, Lawler C7, medium large step bore, with .460 in the valve section. I did not use my “C” trumpet or smaller horns.

For the record I play a GR CS66M as my main mouthpiece. I like the Chase Sanborn rim mainly because I like a sharp bite on my mouthpieces. I have never believed one mouth piece fits all and utilize two other GR mouthpieces; the CS66MS for lead playing in a big band and a custom CS66MX with a 3BB for church work. For everything else the CS66M does the job.

This was a very interesting test, especially since I did not have a clue about the alpha angle, bite, and basic rim shape, other than what I could see on the test models. I may be wrong, but none of the test rims felt as sharp as the CS rim. I rated the test mouthpieces as follows:

1st Place: Blue
2nd Place: Red
3rd Place: Yellow

The Yellow: Felt tight and had little core to the sound. I felt like I could not push the mouthpiece in volume without some distortion in the sound. My attacks were not clean as what I am used to and slurs were fair. The tone color had a little too much edge and I could not play mellow enough to suit me. Control of the dynamics was more difficult.

The Red: Felt larger than the yellow. The attacks were better, but my chops did not lock-in as well as I would like them to. The attacks had a fffaawwhh sound. The attacks took more concentration and effort to be clean. Slurs were good and the overall flexibility of the mouthpiece was better than the yellow.

The Blue: I rated the blue the best. The blue felt larger than the yellow, but similar to the red. The attacks on the blue were the best of the three and I liked the way I could control the dynamics. My lows below the staff were easier to control. The mouthpiece responded nicely at any dynamic level and it was the easiest of the three to play soft. This may sound crazy, but I felt I did not have to work as hard on this mouthpiece as I did on the yellow and red. I could also control the tone color more. The blue mouthpiece allowed for more contrast between mellow and bright, which I really liked on the Lawler C7.

I played the mouthpieces two days. On the first day I warmed up on my CS66M. On the second day I did not play my CS66M, but warmed up on the red, moving to blue, then moving to yellow; then switching back and forth on various tests. It would be interesting to play each mouthpiece by itself for several days to let yourself try to “settle in” before moving to the next mouthpiece.

Bri, I would like to thank you and GR for allowing me to be part of this test. I am already sold on your products and look forward to the tally on the results and your findings.

LATE BREAKING – Bri, I just caught your layovers you posted today!!! I have left my opinions above unchanged. Very interesting!!! My testing results are different than what I am seeing in your layovers. The yellow appears to be the widest in the cup; however it felt smaller and tighter in the test, how can that be? I believe your theory is correct. I look forward to the revelation. Many Thanks.

Mark Alderman
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J-Walk
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PostPosted: Fri May 29, 2009 8:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

B. Scriver wrote:
Here's a new twist to those who have yet to test the GR Mouthpieces. I have added a new layover of the Beta Test Rims to the GR website. Check this out: http://grmouthpieces.com/layovers.htm
You will see the link on the layovers page.

Now let's see if this sways any of the testers. I have a theory that if we have in our minds what we perceive we need, we can easily manipulate the chops to change test results. That is why we originally labelled them with colors as opposed to model numbers. The true reveal is coming soon!

Brian Scriver
www.grmouthpieces.com


Thanks Brian... The layovers looked very consistent in relationship to what I experienced during the testing. Now when are you going to let us in on the rest of the secrets?! I still think that the red rim is a Paul Butcher rim
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mattdalton
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PostPosted: Fri May 29, 2009 9:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The overlays are very interesting Brian. But I am glad I saw them after my testing. Looking at them I can certainly see how Brad thought the blue was the smallest and I thought red was smallest - change the amount of lip intrusion into the cup and you'll feel the contour differently.
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B. Scriver
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PostPosted: Sat May 30, 2009 9:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

A big thanks for all the great thinking and participation, it is truly ground breaking. We appreciate everyone for being a part of this Beta Test. This is just the beginning for this kind of testing and new thinking. GR is already looking at new challenges for the trumpet world. We are hoping to attract a University with a doctoral candidate to do something like this for the final project. Of course this would include many hours learning from GR, coming up with a theory, getting GR to make the pieces for the experiment and then formulating criteria as well as crunching the data. Finally a published report for the trumpet world to consider. Just some forward thinking.

One more clue the Paul Butcher rim was not part of the Beta test kit. Sorry but maybe next time thanks for considering it!

GR and Bri
www.grmouthpieces.com
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wilcox96
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 01, 2009 9:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I checked out the overlays. I, like the others..am also glad to NOT have seen these before hand. I really like the anonymity of this test- to allow us to experience these things as individuals - without preconceived notions. Yeah, Matt... you are right on with that difference. I suppose "I" really ended up making some feel judgements based on alpha angle slopes. I don't think in those terms...but when I compared how I remember each test mpc felt and reacted to "me", then look at the diagram...it makes sense.

What astounds me is the overall flow of the top of each rim. I am blown away that the RED seems to be so rounded. Shocking. To be quite honest...I have been very much considering a change in rims to WHAT "I" BELIEVED to be a flatter rim. My reason is for a perceived need for more cushion and comfort. I would NEVER have thought the RED would be comfortable to me. Shock. Looking at the diagram... I would have picked the BLUE - for two reasons. One - the alpha angle matches what I would "think" I would prefer (slightly sharper...for clean attacks)...and the flatter rim. I can see right away why I'd steer away from the YELLOW. How come that is the only one I can accurately predict from the diagram vs how I react to it???!!!?? hahaha.

I did think the BLUE was very comfortable and had fine attacks. But.. still the RED won out every time.

Now I "know" Brian and Gary are laughing. I am dying for the reveal.
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KingSilverSonic
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 02, 2009 7:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I finished testing the 66 series and here are my thoughts. First, I was playing a 1963 King Silver Sonic Symphony 20 DB. The mouthpiece I normally play is a GR 67 LX, although I somtimes use a 67 MX, and 67 M. A good friend, a pro trumpet player, listened to my test. In all play tests I ranked the mouthpieces from best to worse as Red, Blue, and Yellow. The Blue felt more restrictive, and was a bit stuffy to me. I was not getting a “pure” sound out of this mouthpiece. I did not like the “feel” of the Y mouthpiece on my lips as it felt a little like it was cutting. It did sound better than the B, however. The R mouthpiece felt and sounded the best. After the test my friend agreed that I had the best sound using the R. I then played some of the pieces with my GR LX - and I had missed that I was supposed to have included my mouthpiece in the test. It's a guy thing of not reading the instructions carefully. I liked the play and the feel of the LX over that of the R. My friend agreed that I sounded better with the LX in my horn as compared to the R.

I then gave my friend the mouthpieces and he ran through some warm-ups, high and low notes, and played some parts of various tunes. He did not actually take the test. He liked the Red the best and the Blue the least. His tone using the Blue was a bit "fuzzy;" it was not clear and did not project well. The Yellow sounded OK - but he sounded the best on the Red, and he said he liked the feel. So, here is a non-official result of testing.
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silverhorn
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 03, 2009 3:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Playing tests were done on a 1957 Mt. Vernon Bach Strad model 37 ML bore trumpet that was restored by Charlie Melk. Although I have over 50 mouthpieces in my current collection, my main mouthpiece is a Mt. Vernon Bach 3C and my favorite lead mouthpiece is an Al Cass 3X6. The only GR mouthpiece in my collection so far is a GR 64.7 MS (Trudell rim). I prefer this mouthpiece for commercial style playing and even though the cup depth and diameter are different than the test mouthpieces, I wanted to include it too as part of the testing and focused on comparing the rims versus the effects of other mouthpiece parameters such as cup depth, diameter, backbore, etc.

From from best to worst: R, B, Y, Mt. Vernon Bach 3C, Al Cass 3X6, GR 64.7 MS

4. Playing test #1, breath attack on middle G.
Al Cass 3X6, red, Mt. Vernon Bach 3C, B, GR 64.7 MS, yellow

5. Playing test #2, articulation 16th’s -dotted 1/8th 16th.
Mt. Vernon Bach 3C, B, R, Al Cass 3X6, GR 64.7 MS, yellow

6. Playing test #3, low soft slurs.
Mt. Vernon Bach 3C, B, R, Al Cass 3X6, GR 64.7 MS, yellow

7. Playing test #4, intervals, articulation, intonation, and accuracy.
Mt. Vernon Bach 3C, B, R, Al Cass 3X6, GR 64.7 MS, yellow

8. Playing Test #5, Grandioso, loud to soft.
Al Cass 3X6, red, Mt. Vernon Bach 3C, B, GR 64.7 MS, yellow

9. Which rim felt the best? Al Cass/red

10. Which rim performed the best? Mt. Vernon Bach 3C/blue overall. Al Cass 3X6/red for range and response

11. Which rim felt the biggest? yellow

12. Which rim felt the smallest? red


Comments pertaining to the three beta pieces
• Efficiency- red was the most efficient and yellow the least.

• Intonation – blue had the best intonation and yellow the worst.

• Range – red had the best range and yellow the worst.

• Tone – blue had the best tone and yellow the worst.

• Feel – red had the best feel and yellow the worst.

• Overall- I liked the feel and response of the red the best although the overall performance and sound of the blue the best. For general all around playing my vote goes for the blue for purposes of the poll, but I would prefer the red for range and lead playing.

Summary: I did not see the layovers of the GR rims but by reading the previous posts, I had a feeling of what I would expect the rims to feel like. Interestingly, even though I did not look at the rims until done with the playing tests, I correctly guessed which rims were which. Overall, I still prefer my Mt. Vernon Bach 3C for general playing, but it may be because the cup diameter and depth etc. work best for me. In terms of rim feel, the blue rim felt the closest to the Bach. Even though I’ve never tried a standard GR rim, the blue felt the most like what I believe a “standard” rim should feel like. The high point felt like it was in the middle and because of the balanced feel it performed the best for general playing. The Al Cass 3X6 is also still my favorite lead mouthpiece with the best range and response, but again it may be because the combination of cup depth, backbore, cup diameter, etc. work best for me for that type of playing. However, based on rim alone, the Al Cass still felt the best to me. Al Cass rims are the most comfortable rims I’ve played on and nothing else felt like an Al Cass in the past, but the red rim comes closest to an Al Cass feel. The red rim feels like the high point is closest to the inner edge, making the rim feel smaller for me but also giving me better response and range. Gary Radtke may have unlocked one of the secrets to the famed Al Cass rim design as my Al Cass also feels like the high point is close to the inner edge of the rim although the Al Cass feels like the rim is slightly rounder! Lol. The yellow felt like the high point was more toward the outer edge of the mouthpiece giving it a wider and flatter feel. The yellow rim felt closest to the GR 64.7 MS, which has a semi-flat rim. The 64.7 MS still felt a little flatter overall though.

Thank you again to Gary Radtke, Brian Scriver, and the whole GR team for allowing me and the other TH members to be a part of this study. Look forward to seeing the final results!

For purposes of the poll, I only voted for my results but I had 2 of my friends also try out the mouthpieces and have included their results below:

Guinea Pig Friend #1
Trumpet = ML bore Cannonball Trumpet
From from best to worst: R, B, Y, (X = Bach 7C)

4. Playing test #1, breath attack on middle G.
B, X, Y, R

5. Playing test #2, articulation 16th’s -dotted 1/8th 16th.
B, X, Y, R

6. Playing test #3, low soft slurs.
X, B, R, Y

7. Playing test #4, intervals, articulation, intonation, and accuracy.
X, B, Y, R

8. Playing Test #5, Grandioso, loud to soft.
X, R, Y, B

9. Which rim felt the best? Blue

10. Which rim performed the best? Blue

11. Which rim felt the biggest? Yellow

12. Which rim felt the smallest? Red

Comments pertaining to the three beta pieces
Yellow was difficult to go low range. Everything else felt very well.
Blue felt the best with range top and bottom.
Red was not as responsive.


Guinea Pig Friend #2
Trumpet = Large bore Getzen Renaissance
From from best to worst: R, B, Y, X (X=Yamaha Shew Lead)

4. Playing test #1, breath attack on middle G.
R, B, Y

5. Playing test #2, articulation 16th’s -dotted 1/8th 16th.
R, B, Y

6. Playing test #3, low soft slurs.
R, Y, B

7. Playing test #4, intervals, articulation, intonation, and accuracy.
R, Y, B

8. Playing Test #5, Grandioso, loud to soft.
Y, R, B

9. Which rim felt the best? R

10. Which rim performed the best? R

11. Which rim felt the biggest? B

12. Which rim felt the smallest? R

Comments pertaining to the three beta pieces
From scale of 1-10 (1= worst, 10=best)
• Efficiency- Y6, B8, R9
• Intonation – Y8, B8, R9
• Range – Y7, B6, R9
• Tone – Y8, B8, R6
• Feel – Y8, B8, R8
• Overall- Y7. B8. R9
Cup volume feels smaller on blue


Last edited by silverhorn on Thu Jun 04, 2009 1:54 pm; edited 1 time in total
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razeontherock
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 03, 2009 5:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This is amazing to see and reinforces something I've said on TH many times, but not excessively:

a small difference in metal will make a big difference in playing!

GREAT to see this type of research being done.
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linkera
Regular Member


Joined: 25 Aug 2002
Posts: 20

PostPosted: Thu Jun 04, 2009 6:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Recieved the test set yesterday and have done the tests a few times since then.
1. What horn are you playing? Wild Thing
2. What Mouthpiece are you playing now? Northern Brass 63***** made by GR.
3. What is your playing level? Semi Retired but still play a few times per week.
4. Playing test #1, breath attack on middle G. R,B,X,Y I should start by saying my mouthpiece is smaller than the 65's used in the test. In this test all of the pieces seemed to be good.
5. Playing test #2, articulation 16ths - dotted 1/8th and 16th. R,B,Y,X The red seemed to speak more clearly and actually made it a little eaisier
to read the exercise which suprised me. Maybe it was just in my head but that is how I pictured it.
6. Playing test #3, low soft slurs. R,Y,B,X All of the test pieces have a bigger sound than my 63*****. They also speak a lot quicker than mine but the majority of gigs I play are R&B so I am always pushing hard. The WT can take all you can give it so the tighter mouthpiece gives me something to lean on.
7. Playing test #4, intervals, articulation, intonation, and accuracy. R,B,Y, X The blue actually felt better but the red was more accurate and more clean.
8. Playing test #5, Grandioso, loud to soft. R,B,X,Y
All of the mouthpieces did well here but there is definitely something about the red one. Cleaness of attack is noticeably better.
9. Which rim felt the best? B,R,Y,X
10. Which rim performed the best? R,B,Y,X The red had a crispness to it that I definitely like. The blue seemed to have darker overtones or maybe less highs that I tend to like in a jazz setting but most of my playing is done where brightness helps cut through.
11. Which rim felt the biggest? Y,B,R,X This could be embarrasing but to me, the yellow seemed to be larger. I liked the mellowness of the blue and the red seemed best for overall playing.
12. Which rim felt the smallest? X,R,B,Y
!3, MY comments. I have liked something about every GR that I have played. I think now I see the need for seeing a GR consultant. I brought the blue to a rehearsal tonight for a gig this week at the house of blues, and found it too open....but for the rehearsal we were playing without mikes so I might have pushed too hard.
I would like to thank you guys allowing me to participate in this test and hope you can glean something from my responses. I am glad you guys understand what makes this engine run 'cause I sure don't. I'm thinking that for my playing maybe I should try 64 rims. I'm thinking they would give be better overall playablity, while leaving a little something for me to lean on. Again, thanks GR and Brian. I still have a day or so to try the pieces sooo if anything changes I'll be back.
allan linker
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B. Scriver
Heavyweight Member


Joined: 14 Jan 2002
Posts: 1204
Location: Toronto, Canada

PostPosted: Thu Jun 04, 2009 8:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

razeontherock wrote:
This is amazing to see and reinforces something I've said on TH many times, but not excessively:

a small difference in metal will make a big difference in playing!

GREAT to see this type of research being done.


Ray,
Thanks for your support!
Better get over to Charlie's Brass asap! All the samples from ITG will be there for a while and there is some smaller stuff you might want to try. There are over 200 different models that will arrive tomorrow.
Included are some special pieces:

60 VM Bud Brisbios upgrade
62 VM
61A Al Hirt with T-72S BB
62.5 SZ Giardnelli 10S upgrade
Groovin High 2
Carl Fischer Jazz
Goz 1- Bert Herrik upgrade
Malcolm 1-66 dia low alpha

Brian Scriver
www.grmouthpieces.com
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x3matt
Veteran Member


Joined: 03 Sep 2004
Posts: 106
Location: Emory, VA

PostPosted: Thu Jun 04, 2009 11:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I just finished with the test and my results were:

1st : Blue
2nd : Red
3rd: Yellow

The blue and the red were pretty close, I think that I like my old piece, a hammond a little better, but they were good mouthpieces.
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