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How many high note specialists posting on TH are full of it? |
95% are full of it |
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19% |
[ 8 ] |
75% are full of it |
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43% |
[ 18 ] |
50% are full of it |
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29% |
[ 12 ] |
25% are full of it |
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4% |
[ 2 ] |
Everyone's telling the truth |
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2% |
[ 1 ] |
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Total Votes : 41 |
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Dale Proctor Heavyweight Member
Joined: 26 May 2005 Posts: 9382 Location: Heart of Dixie
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Posted: Sun Jul 31, 2005 7:11 pm Post subject: Who's Full of IT? |
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Looking through the "High Range Development" forum, it appears that a vast majority of players are not only capable of hitting notes to double high C and beyond, but regularly perform in this range. Do you believe this, or do you think some of the posters are "full of it"? _________________ "Brass bands are all very well in their place - outdoors and several miles away ." - Sir Thomas Beecham |
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ustacouldplay Heavyweight Member
Joined: 24 Sep 2004 Posts: 970 Location: Atlanta, GA
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Posted: Sun Jul 31, 2005 7:26 pm Post subject: |
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I think probably everyone exaggerates at least a little but I only think about 50% of the people on here are completely FOS. _________________ John Ford's next stop:
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deleted_user_c11c97e New Member
Joined: 03 Apr 1996 Posts: 0
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blasticore Heavyweight Member
Joined: 09 Aug 2002 Posts: 3045 Location: Orlando, FL
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Posted: Sun Jul 31, 2005 8:58 pm Post subject: |
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I say 50%. I think a lot of the people talking about the stuff are a little hazy on the definition of being able to perform a note, and that's what'll cause some speculation as to (and I sigh even saying this phrase) how high they can play.
I hardly ever use the high range forum myself, but I can imagine the BS that must fly around within its walls. _________________ Chris King
http://www.cktrumpet.com
http://www.ckbrassworks.com |
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deleted_user_c11c97e New Member
Joined: 03 Apr 1996 Posts: 0
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Posted: Sun Jul 31, 2005 9:53 pm Post subject: |
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The purpose of that forum, I believe is to learn how to play high. Sure, you have to sift through the crap to find gold... |
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DaveH Heavyweight Member
Joined: 20 Nov 2001 Posts: 3861
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Posted: Mon Aug 01, 2005 6:58 am Post subject: |
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IMHO...and based on years of personal experience and observation...and the "words of wisdom" of people I have known personally who are qualified to comment, and not on Internet "conversation."
I would say at the very least 75%. Probably more.
Again, I am guessing.
But, I am convinced, again based on my opening paragraph, that playing in the extreme high register is not a common and readily accessible performance attribute.
When I say playing, I mean exactly that. NOT someone who accidentally gets lucky and somehow squeaks out a double high C at the risk of their head exploding and their eyeballs falling out; but plays it with reasonable ease, good tone, good intonation, and with a level of consistency that allows one to say that the tones in the extreme high register actually can be produced at any time, on demand, with confidence, in performance, and with a sound that is musically and auditorily excellent.
Given the total number of people who claim to play the trumpet, I think the abilities and skills I have mentioned are generally to be found among the minority of players.
I am also convinced that certain players have physical make-ups that greatly FACILITATE this kind of playing. I think that certain dental, lip, and facial structures will either help or hinder this kind of playing. And, that doing it doesn't come overnight, but takes years of dedicated work, along with good instruction supervising the techniques needed to actually play in that range.
Again, it is my opinion...FWIW... |
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Dale Proctor Heavyweight Member
Joined: 26 May 2005 Posts: 9382 Location: Heart of Dixie
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Posted: Mon Aug 01, 2005 8:07 am Post subject: |
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DaveH, I agree with you completely. I've squeeked out a couple of double high C's in my life, but I wouldn't claim I could PLAY in that range. People who can consistently play musically in the extreme high register are probably in the upper 5th percentile or smaller. I'd say my usable, consistent range on a Bb trumpet ends with an E above high C (if I'm in good shape practice-wise), and that's only if I'm fresh.
Now, who thinks I'm full of it? _________________ "Brass bands are all very well in their place - outdoors and several miles away ." - Sir Thomas Beecham |
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DaveH Heavyweight Member
Joined: 20 Nov 2001 Posts: 3861
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Posted: Mon Aug 01, 2005 8:49 am Post subject: |
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Not me...I think you are describing what is the general reality- give or take a note or two - for a very large amount; perhaps even most, excellent trumpet players in general. |
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Ben17 Veteran Member
Joined: 16 Sep 2004 Posts: 361 Location: Mesa, Az
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Posted: Mon Aug 01, 2005 10:28 am Post subject: |
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I know this kind of goes against the original question. But I would like to think that with a strict practice routine I can get the double C, and use it on a regular basis. I mean, I've already got the doulbe G, what's to stop me from more? A few years ago I was only at a high G, and at 18 I have a double G. While there are tons of kids my age or slightly older that just blow my existence away with awesome capabilties, like Andrew Fowler, I'd still like to think I can improve my range. Maybe your right, and maybe I will plateau. I don't expect to go much beyond a double C, just enough to make that note work. O yeah, and I do think many posters there are full of it. |
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old geezer Veteran Member
Joined: 23 Nov 2004 Posts: 324 Location: Indianapolis
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Posted: Mon Aug 01, 2005 10:44 am Post subject: |
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Hey Gary - - thanks alot, I played that sound clip and dogs all over my neighborhood started howling. haha old geezer Dave _________________ L.A. Benge 2ML 16389
L.A. Benge 2MLP 11745
K. Allman 1414
Yamaha Mike Vax 450573
Yamaha 231 Flugel 15383
Olds Amb. Cornet 50734 |
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dbacon Heavyweight Member
Joined: 11 Nov 2001 Posts: 8592
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Posted: Mon Aug 01, 2005 10:48 am Post subject: |
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Ben17 wrote: | I know this kind of goes against the original question. But I would like to think that with a strict practice routine I can get the double C, and use it on a regular basis. I mean, I've already got the doulbe G, what's to stop me from more? A few years ago I was only at a high G, and at 18 I have a double G. While there are tons of kids my age or slightly older that just blow my existence away with awesome capabilties, like Andrew Fowler, I'd still like to think I can improve my range. Maybe your right, and maybe I will plateau. I don't expect to go much beyond a double C, just enough to make that note work. O yeah, and I do think many posters there are full of it. |
Ben, if you want to develop your playing take lessons from Kurt Finchum. He's down in your area, is one of the finest players anywhere, has high chops with great sound, exceptional jazz player, wonderful teacher and good cat!! Check him out. |
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Ben17 Veteran Member
Joined: 16 Sep 2004 Posts: 361 Location: Mesa, Az
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Posted: Mon Aug 01, 2005 11:34 am Post subject: |
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Thanks Dave, I'll definetley remember that once I get back in to the swing of things this school year. |
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davidk Veteran Member
Joined: 30 Sep 2004 Posts: 487 Location: Washington DC
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Posted: Mon Aug 01, 2005 12:18 pm Post subject: |
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Gary Wilder wrote: | http://www.eclipsetrumpets.com/d.mp3
Judge for yourself. |
Nice! I think my speaker broke!
If you can play a fat Dbl C like that, you own the note. If you can't, then you're just occasionally lucky. At least, that's my opinion and that of several other guys in my area. If you can play a note multiple times in a day, not just once or twice, and control it, you own it. If you can't, well, keep practicing. |
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trumpetmike Heavyweight Member
Joined: 15 Aug 2003 Posts: 11315 Location: Ash (an even smaller place ), UK
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Posted: Mon Aug 01, 2005 3:18 pm Post subject: |
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I would suggest that the answers apply to much of the "knowledge" that can be found on just about every forum. There will be "players" who claim mastery of certain aspects of playing, if not every aspect of playing - the number of those people who can actually do half of what they claim is probably not too high.
There are certain people on TH that I know can do what they say (from personal, first hand experience), there are those that I believe can do it (through reputation and what they say) and there are those who are full of it. This goes for more than just who can play double c. |
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ustacouldplay Heavyweight Member
Joined: 24 Sep 2004 Posts: 970 Location: Atlanta, GA
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Posted: Mon Aug 01, 2005 7:15 pm Post subject: |
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I got a new perspective from a guy who joined a group I'm in that plays everything from swing to rock to Sousa. He was telling me how he played the "scream chair" or whatever you wanna call it in a band in college. He said basically he would lay out until he had a dubba' note here then a dubba' note there. I'm like, man, if all I had to do was rest up and hit about 40 notes a night, I could probably claim to "own" the notes, too. It's the 2,673 notes in between that kill me. _________________ John Ford's next stop:
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gio trumpeter Heavyweight Member
Joined: 02 Jul 2004 Posts: 894 Location: Las Vegas, Nevada
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Posted: Mon Aug 01, 2005 7:58 pm Post subject: |
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Most are lying.... i for one am not I provided video
but a lot are over exaggerating |
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blasticore Heavyweight Member
Joined: 09 Aug 2002 Posts: 3045 Location: Orlando, FL
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Posted: Mon Aug 01, 2005 8:01 pm Post subject: |
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ustacouldplay wrote: | I got a new perspective from a guy who joined a group I'm in that plays everything from swing to rock to Sousa. He was telling me how he played the "scream chair" or whatever you wanna call it in a band in college. He said basically he would lay out until he had a dubba' note here then a dubba' note there. I'm like, man, if all I had to do was rest up and hit about 40 notes a night, I could probably claim to "own" the notes, too. It's the 2,673 notes in between that kill me. |
Hahaha, we played an arrangement of Centerpiece in Jazz band during the fall semester of my freshman year. The 4th (or 5th; I forget which) was exactly like that when it came to the second page or so. Misfortune peeking its head into my life, I had the part, and the scream solos. I coudn't figure out why either. We had a guy that played lead/solos with the Crossmen a few years ago in the section who was perfectly capable.
After hacking it every single time we played it, I'm actually glad some guys can do that crap. _________________ Chris King
http://www.cktrumpet.com
http://www.ckbrassworks.com |
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mafields627 Heavyweight Member
Joined: 09 Nov 2001 Posts: 3779 Location: AL
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Posted: Mon Aug 01, 2005 8:25 pm Post subject: |
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Sometimes the high-note parts aren't the "lead", or first book, part. _________________ --Matt--
No representation is made that the quality of this post is greater than the quality of that of any other poster. Oh, and get a teacher! |
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cjdjazztpt Heavyweight Member
Joined: 05 Jul 2004 Posts: 1534 Location: Nashville, TN/ New Orleans, LA
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Posted: Mon Aug 01, 2005 8:49 pm Post subject: |
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Being able to play a note when just warming up is one thing...playing that note at the end of the night is another. You own the note when you can hit it 8 or 9 times out of 10. (1 or 2 miss(es) for human error)
Sqeaking a double C doesnt mean you can hit the note. Hitting the Dubba C with power and control 9 times out of 10 means you own the note. There was a discussion about this in another forum and a guy posted that he can hit double C but at the end of a gig his range is right at high D. Thats 5 whole steps. So to me that guy owns a high D and nothing above because thats the note he can RELY on at the end of his gig. To me range should only decrease a step (or two) by the end of the night. Nice clip Gary. Short and SWEET. |
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Dale Proctor Heavyweight Member
Joined: 26 May 2005 Posts: 9382 Location: Heart of Dixie
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Posted: Tue Aug 02, 2005 7:59 am Post subject: |
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Right, and this poll is not intended to insult those few who do OWN those notes in the stratosphere. You guys (and you know who you are) who have mastered this and can still produce a pleasing tone in the normal range have my utmost respect - I'm not worthy to carry your cup mute!
You other posers (and you know who YOU are, too) will eventually brag yourselves into an embarassing performance situation. I've had experience with far more mediocre players who talked a good talk than I have with good players who could back it up (come to think of it, most good players don't lie about their abilities - they're usually humble). Have fun. _________________ "Brass bands are all very well in their place - outdoors and several miles away ." - Sir Thomas Beecham |
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