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chet_fan
Regular Member
Joined: 11 Sep 2023
Posts: 20
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 Posted: Thu Oct 12, 2023 4:24 pm Post subject: I can play high..er |
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So last night and tonight I had a breakthrough. I'm not Ferguson or Faddis but my range opened up and I didn't suffer the chop fatigue that I had in the past when trying to play high for me. I've taken many lessons and no teacher has been able to communicate to me the importance of being full of air and giving that little push of compression to get over the edge.
I'm sorry, I'm probably not explaining this properly. I'm still processing. |
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Robert P
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Joined: 28 Feb 2013
Posts: 2596
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| Posted: Thu Oct 12, 2023 8:42 pm Post subject: Re: I can play high..er |
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| chet_fan wrote: | So last night and tonight I had a breakthrough. I'm not Ferguson or Faddis but my range opened up and I didn't suffer the chop fatigue that I had in the past when trying to play high for me. I've taken many lessons and no teacher has been able to communicate to me the importance of being full of air and giving that little push of compression to get over the edge.
I'm sorry, I'm probably not explaining this properly. I'm still processing. |
A teacher isn't going to be able to explain what they themselves aren't aware of. From what I've read Maynard wasn't able to help his own son progress on trumpet. Based on clinic videos I've seen it's not surprising - it came naturally to Maynard and he didn't fully understand how he was able to do what he did.
It's a sum of a bunch of parts that *all* have to be there. Air is essential but it's not the whole answer.
Some people have an advantage due to having more cooperative chops but it's likely that most people can make progress. Once upon a time a G was absolutely beyond the realm of possibility for me - utterly inconceivable, now it's not a big deal. Heck at one time a free, solid high C was inconceivable to me.
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Trumpjerele
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Joined: 20 Feb 2019
Posts: 171
Location: Spain
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| Posted: Thu Oct 12, 2023 10:18 pm Post subject: |
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If you're going to start obsessing about high notes, I think you should change your nick!!!
Seriously speaking, Jeff Smiley in his book Balanced Embouchure recommends it. And before him Claude Gordon I think too.
Although I've also heard people recommend taking little air to avoid overblowing.
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JayKosta
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Joined: 24 Dec 2018
Posts: 3308
Location: Endwell NY USA
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| Posted: Fri Oct 13, 2023 4:53 am Post subject: Re: I can play high..er |
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| chet_fan wrote: | | ... the importance of being full of air and giving that little push of compression to get over the edge. ... |
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It's not that you need to be 'full of air', just that you need enough internal air so your physical actions of 'blowing harder' can produce higher internal air pressure with good air flow. A lot depends on your sensation of how much air you have inhaled, and whether your inhalation is somehow being restricted.
Another item is that to achieve the higher internal air pressure you need to prevent the 'blowing harder' from only resulting in louder playing. So you need to control the out-flow of the air. That control is done by adjustments to the lip aperture - its size and flexibility. The control is done by a combination of many things: mouthpiece positioning and rim pressure, muscles that affect the lips, jaw, and tongue.
Lips HAVE to be ABLE to vibrate
Air has to FLOW through the aperture
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chet_fan
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Joined: 11 Sep 2023
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| Posted: Fri Oct 13, 2023 5:58 am Post subject: |
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| Thanks for all the replies. I'm still trying to internalize it. I suppose that is a life long pursuit. |
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kalijah
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Joined: 06 Nov 2003
Posts: 3260
Location: Alabama
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| Posted: Fri Oct 13, 2023 8:06 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | I've taken many lessons and no teacher has been able to communicate to me the importance of being full of air and giving that little push of compression to get over the edge. |
Good luck finding any reasonable or logical instruction about "air".
You can control the air pressure for a wide range of lung state (that is, fullness of lungs) and one should be able to play within the extremes of lung fullness.
There is NOTHING wrong with a full breath and many find the elastic recoil pressure for this state helpful. Also, holding your breath does not necessarily cause "tension" as so many claim if done correctly.
Efficient tone production also REDUCES the air power required to play in general. |
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Shaft
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cool_wind
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Joined: 21 Dec 2023
Posts: 11
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| Posted: Fri Dec 29, 2023 5:23 pm Post subject: |
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| Wow, amazing video. |
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kalijah
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Location: Alabama
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| Posted: Sat Dec 30, 2023 7:47 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | It’s not available free on a blog, though. |
Actually. It is. |
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abontrumpet
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Joined: 08 May 2009
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| Posted: Sat Dec 30, 2023 8:04 am Post subject: Re: Readily available |
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| DFC1 wrote: | “Good luck finding any reasonable or logical instruction about "air".”
This (reasonable and logical, not to mention excellent) instruction is readily available at places like Eastman, Juilliard . . . |
Oops. Since you are new here, perhaps you don't really understand what kalijah is talking about.
Yes, the institutions you've mentioned have great students and often solid instruction. However, if you read kalijah's posts, even the one you quote from, you'll see he talks about air in proper terms.
At most of those institutions you generally don't hear the term "air-power." In fact I am almost 100% positive you won't hear that term. You will hear terms that "get close enough" that are very useful in becoming better at breathing on the trumpet, but it is hard to the find "proper" instruction that takes into account what kalijah is able to capture.
Hope that helps! |
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peanuts56
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Joined: 21 Nov 2021
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| Posted: Sat Dec 30, 2023 10:05 am Post subject: |
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Most of what I learned about opening up my upper register was learned through trial and error. I had decent range but wasn't playing efficiently.
I had taken some lessons with Jerry Callet. Jerry had an amazing upper register but wasn't really great at explaining things. He would lapse into telling stories. I had a revelation about some of what he was talking about while on vacation. I brought my mp along and something clicked. The other thing that helped was Jeff Smiley's book. |
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kehaulani
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Joined: 23 Mar 2003
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Location: Hawai`i - Texas
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| Posted: Sat Dec 30, 2023 11:54 am Post subject: |
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There are a lot of things that go into high-note playing and they're not even the same from person-to-person (although there are commonalities).
My "Ah-Ha" moment came very late in life and that was the simple realization that you don't have to clamp down like a crazed gorilla on your mouthpiece.
Saw too many hot-dogging lead players that, in actuality, probably weren't putting out a fraction of tension on their mouthpiece that they showed, physically, when playing those notes.
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kalijah
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| Posted: Sat Dec 30, 2023 12:03 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | My "Ah-Ha" moment came very late in life and that was the simple realization that you don't have to clamp down like a crazed gorilla on your mouthpiece. |
For sure!
I also found that habitually reducing the effort in the LOWEST and SOFTEST regions is easy to achieve first with HOURS of Clarke type studies. Then gradually ascending over time with the smallest possible incremental effort. Exploit the resonance of the instrument and stop playing as if forcing the sound on a mouthpiece "buzz". |
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Denny Schreffler
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Don Herman rev2
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Location: Monument, CO
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| Posted: Mon Jan 01, 2024 8:55 am Post subject: |
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I spent some time with Jim Manley years ago. In addition to his teaching, he is an impressive player and a wonderful human being. And has another TH'r said, plays almost effortlessly, and you could wake him up at 7 am with a $10 bill and he'd nail a double C cold.
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