"Civilian" perception of what's upper range

[Croquethed]

We on the inside of the trumpet community have been more or less conditioned to believe that if we top out at D or E above high C that our range is somehow inadequate.

But a question to my brethren here who gig regularly - when you are out and about on stage, is there any particular cut-off where you as a player are not particularly impressed with yourself but the audience is?

I ask because I was recently at a show where the trumpet player hit a nice strong E and the audience was mightily impressed. Made me start wondering at which point those who do not play think of us as some sort of superhero.

[Craig Swartz]

I'm not certain what you are really asking for, but in my experience in a large number of performances from solo to rock band to small jazz to big band to brass ensemble to symphony orchestras over the past 50 years, it has been the musicianship and ability to "sell" the musical product as intended by the composer which has had the greatest impression on the listeners, from church service to concert hall.

There are/have been performers who are known primarily for their range, however, they likely never would've been listened to in the first place had they not been able to stir something very positive inside a large number of listeners, making them want to hear more. Bill Chase, MF, Doc, et al, played more than high notes. Singer, instrumentalist, composer: it's the passion that leaves the impression.

[Brad361]

This is just my experience: for my gigs, (12 piece funk / r&b band ) I pretty much need a useable, controlled and consistent (including in a third set) F-F#.
(I top out at G). I’ve noticed though that in general, most audiences don’t really notice. I think to the average non-musician person in the crowd, anything up to that point is just expected, but not really noticed as being anything exceptional. I think until you get to the double C area most people just hear “horns.” I might be incorrect though, since I generally don’t HAVE a double C.

Also interesting is that on nights I feel especially strong, I’m pretty much the only person (except for the sax and t bone to some extent) who notices.
Same thing on those (occasional, thankfully) nights when nothing is working correctly.

Brad
_________________
When asked if he always sounds great:
"I always try, but not always, because the horn is merciless, unpredictable and traitorous." - Arturo Sandoval

[Craig Swartz]

On the range demands of most modern shows, I'd have to agree with Brad. Just about every 21st Century show I've played in the last 10 years has demanded an F above "high C" and the orchestra pops stuff has also been demanding ever-higher range requirements as well.

[deanoaks]

My first very instructor in the early 00s told me the only functional range needed was an upper E, just to be able to play any rep that might come my way as a classical musician and freelancer. In the past 10 or so years, there have been situations where I've needed as high as an A over high C.

I've not noticed audience members get too impressed with high notes, but I have seen lots of people absolutely lose their minds over piccolo trumpet playing. Even if said piccolo playing doesn't extend past a concert D or even hang out in the upper register of the instrument.

[Brad361]

[Doug Elliott]

On my own gigs, playing my own arrangements, I am far more impressed by a player I hired who knows what to leave out or take down so that a high C or D sounds fantastic and solid with projection and sizzle. I really don't want to hear somebody "almost" play an E, F, G, or A that I wrote knowing full well only a few players will be able play them with authority.

Play what you've got and do it well.

[JayKosta]

[astadler]

[Brad361]

[JayKosta]

[Brad361]

Ok, maybe we’re just debating semantics.

It’s my experience that a lot of “commercial” (at least in my definition of “commercial”) playing is going to require at least an F, probably a step or two higher. Lead parts for Kenton / Ferguson / Rich jazz band, definitely, at least a G-A. Symphonic / classical, no. So if you’re a “freelance classical player”, and don’t really HAVE (meaning “can play”) anything above D, you’re probably ok, you won’t really need it. Although, playing at the very top of your range can get dicey, if we’re talking about PLAYING, not just HITTING the notes.

Brad
_________________
When asked if he always sounds great:
"I always try, but not always, because the horn is merciless, unpredictable and traitorous." - Arturo Sandoval

[Craig Swartz]

Just about everything thing in this conversation will hinge on where you are, who is available, and how demanding the performance will be. If you're doing a HS or community show in West Armpit, OH, and you're the best player available, there's a damn good chance you'll be able to play those notes out of your range down an octave and the local director will be just as happy. If, however, you're drawing a paycheck in just about any metro area 50K or larger, there's a pretty fair chance the contractor will be able to find someone who can do the job if you can't. I've even played in a number of large church Praise Bands recently where at least 2 of the trumpet players were quite comfortable up above "high C"- locals I'd never met not heard of.

Best bet if you want to play? Build your chops. This includes range, but also the types of styles, overall experience in diverse playing, terminology, and the ability to get along with the ones you'll be playing with. And if you're new to the group, try listening and figuring out "questions" before asking them. Observe, observe, observe. In the big world, if you start asking what you may think are "intelligent questions", you may end up being told to do a whole lot of things you'd rather not have to do. But WTH? You asked!!

NBD- in the end we all have to learn...

[Brad361]

THIS. ☝️☝️☝️☝️☝️

TH needs a “like” button.

Brad
_________________
When asked if he always sounds great:
"I always try, but not always, because the horn is merciless, unpredictable and traitorous." - Arturo Sandoval

[marathoner]

West Armpit Ohio ? I think Craig Swartz is a "Burner account" for Jim Harbaugh !!!!

[Cuso]

Well, I'll state the obvious.

Civilians don't perceive high notes as we do, they perceive emotions. One of those is excitement, and what is perceived as musically exciting differs from person to person. And from style to style.

A Salsa crowd needs G's+ to get warm, where a Funk audience might get off on a E or F at the ending. If you play a DHC at a Dixieland Matinee someone might just cough up their beer.

I've got a usable E so I'm staying away from the Salsa books, however at the last Funk gig I played, I did get the audience excited.

I gave them what they wanted/needed, and therefore I am a Superhero.
_________________
YTR 8310Z III
YTR 8335 LAS II
'72 Benge 3X
Couesnon Flugelhorn
Yamaha YTR-9820 Piccolo

[kehaulani]

[Craig Swartz]

"A Salsa crowd needs G's+ to get warm, where a Funk audience might get off on a E or F at the ending. If you play a DHC at a Dixieland Matinee someone might just cough up their beer."

Cripes! The crowd, or the trumpet player sitting in the crowd, not the band??? I see you are in Germany, perhaps things are different there. Still, IME, good music, well-played, is what "turns people on". Play crap as loud as you want, it may impress someone but I doubt it'll take one very far.

And I'm assuming this "civillians" crowd to whom you refer is the non-trumpet playing audience/attendees? Again, I'm sitting in the upper middle of the US and things may be different here than the rest of the world...

And BTW- I've been "around" longer than Jim Harboughlll

[Brad361]

[ads22]