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kehaulani
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 23 Mar 2003
Posts: 9100
Location: Hawai`i - Texas
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 Posted: Thu Sep 01, 2022 3:12 pm Post subject: |
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That's a constant mantra here but when I was a full-time free lancer, music director and arranger, I still had prodigious time on a certain forum. I would just internet between activities. It adds up fast. Workload doesn't have to be a disqualifying factor.
So. for those like me, we're back to square one.
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Crazy Finn
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Joined: 27 Dec 2001
Posts: 8346
Location: Twin Cities, Minnesota
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| Posted: Thu Sep 01, 2022 5:14 pm Post subject: |
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| kehaulani wrote: | Since I originated this, maybe I'll add some thoughts.
I've very seldom seen posts where a poster attacked others outright. Yes, some silly statements but almost no outright aggression or insulting posts. There is one poster who I think is too blunt, but that's only one. And I can deal with that.
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Well, I remember the thread in which Trent decided he was done with Trumpet Herald, and that definitely was happening there.
I'm sure professionals CAN deal with internet keyboard jockies. It's just that, in their free time, it's just not worth it at some point, when some anonymous dude keeps calling you out. You just don't need that in your life causing you annoyance with little benefit. So, they peace out.
It's unfortunate.
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LittleRusty
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 11 Aug 2004
Posts: 12688
Location: Gardena, Ca
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| Posted: Thu Sep 01, 2022 5:57 pm Post subject: |
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OP,
Respectfully there seems to be an undercurrent that you would like the quality of discussion to be raised. As you probably can tell by my contributions to this thread I don’t think it will bring back or keep pros. But I do agree that raising the quality is a worthwhile goal. |
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Don Herman rev2
'Chicago School' Forum Moderator
Joined: 03 May 2005
Posts: 8961
Location: Monument, CO
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| Posted: Fri Sep 02, 2022 7:01 am Post subject: |
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Many pros have gotten fed up and left, often over attacks and endless debate with far less qualified players. You do not see the attacks because the Moderators delete them as soon as they are noticed (or brought to their attention). Sometimes they just get busy, or get tired of answering the same question 1000 times, and more than one has mentioned that people might be better off practicing than posting (a comment I tend to associate with endless posts on minutiae, at least as they see it).
Raising the bar on posting quality is always a nice goal, and over the years (decades, now) I have been on TH the tide comes and goes. It is hard to step back and wait, count ten or whatever, and re-read a post a couple of times trying to see the other side before posting something negative. Sometimes the best post is no post.
My opinion - Don
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Trumpjerele
Veteran Member
Joined: 20 Feb 2019
Posts: 182
Location: Spain
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| Posted: Fri Sep 02, 2022 8:13 am Post subject: |
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I don't think there are no professionals in the forum, possibly there is a lack of world-class professionals, which seems normal to me.
For example, I know that Andrea Guifredi was a user of the forum many years ago.
Now he has a Youtube channel, he uploads quality content but I haven't seen any response from him to the comments on his videos. what does it matter? He makes a great contribution to the community.
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cbtj51
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 24 Nov 2015
Posts: 737
Location: SE US
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| Posted: Fri Sep 02, 2022 8:44 am Post subject: |
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| Don Herman rev2 wrote: | | Sometimes the best post is no post. My opinion - Don |
A very challenging charge indeed, in a very imperfect environment in fact!
Life is Short, find the Joy in it!
Mike
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Don Herman rev2
'Chicago School' Forum Moderator
Joined: 03 May 2005
Posts: 8961
Location: Monument, CO
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| Posted: Fri Sep 02, 2022 1:47 pm Post subject: |
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| Trumpjerele wrote: | | I don't think there are no professionals in the forum, possibly there is a lack of world-class professionals, which seems normal to me.
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There have been, and are today, "world-class" professionals on TH. Check out some of the threads where they are working through etudes to stay in shape, and now and then post to help others out. I still remember Arturo calling me in the middle of the night in response to a PM and talking for an hour or so, what a great experience! And I have had exchanges (email, PM, voice) with a few others over the years. The last few years my workload has risen exponentially and playing decreased to almost nothing, so I don't hang around here as much, but still notice we have some great players present.
No, I am not one of them...
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Tom LeCompte
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 29 Mar 2004
Posts: 3341
Location: Naperville, Illinois
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| Posted: Fri Sep 02, 2022 2:16 pm Post subject: |
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| Trumpjerele wrote: | | possibly there is a lack of world-class professionals. |
I would consider Tim Wendt a world-class professional. |
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JayKosta
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 24 Dec 2018
Posts: 3349
Location: Endwell NY USA
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| Posted: Fri Sep 02, 2022 2:21 pm Post subject: How pros view TH |
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How pros view TH ...
https://twitter.com/i/status/1565696652094078978
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Most Important Note ? - the next one !
KNOW (see) what the next note is BEFORE you have to play it.
PLAY the next note 'on time' and 'in rhythm'.
Oh ya, watch the conductor - they set what is 'on time'. |
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PH
Bill Adam/Carmine Caruso Forum Moderator
Joined: 26 Nov 2001
Posts: 5862
Location: New Albany, Indiana
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| Posted: Sat Sep 03, 2022 3:41 pm Post subject: Re: Why few professionals on TH? |
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| LittleRusty wrote: | | kehaulani wrote: | Some possibilities:
*redundant threads.
*quibbling over minutiae that don't really have practical use.
*repeating things they have no personal experience with; i.e. "urban myths".
*to gearhead oriented.
*no substantial discussions on musical themes.
*threads that make too big a departure from the OP question.
Anything else?
And what can we do to attract them back? |
IMHO I don’t believe any of these apply, except in the general sense that many people, myself included, don’t want to spend their down time discussing their jobs.
My personal belief is that they were driven off due to the same reasons James Becker and Trent Austin were. That is the blatant disrespect and attacks from the anonymous random keyboard jockies. |
This is exactly right. I've stuck around and remained a moderator because I believe the mission is still valid, but back in the hey day of TH there were many serious and successful pros who contributed. Most were run off by disrespect and personal attacks from anonymous posters who didn't care who suffered. They knew more than the pros.
I think, short of everyone inviting some of these folks back, you won't see that happen here to the degree that it did 10-15 years ago.
P
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Shark01
Veteran Member
Joined: 10 Jun 2017
Posts: 287
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| Posted: Wed Sep 07, 2022 10:43 am Post subject: |
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| I know of a principal player of a major US orchestra that at least lurks regularly. When I posted I was looking for a particular instrument, he reached out and sold me his…..and let me tell you, the guy knows how to pick great trumpets. |
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bamajazzlady
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 22 May 2011
Posts: 691
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| Posted: Mon Sep 12, 2022 6:42 pm Post subject: |
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| Shark01 wrote: | | I know of a principal player of a major US orchestra that at least lurks regularly. When I posted I was looking for a particular instrument, he reached out and sold me his…..and let me tell you, the guy knows how to pick great trumpets. |
Is it “MrClean” ?
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"Nobody can go back and start a new beginning, but anyone can start today and make a new ending." - Maria Robinson |
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LaTrompeta
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 03 May 2015
Posts: 868
Location: West Side, USA
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| Posted: Mon Sep 12, 2022 9:22 pm Post subject: |
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| bamajazzlady wrote: | | Shark01 wrote: | | I know of a principal player of a major US orchestra that at least lurks regularly. When I posted I was looking for a particular instrument, he reached out and sold me his…..and let me tell you, the guy knows how to pick great trumpets. |
Is it “MrClean” ? |
It's well known that MrClean is Jim Wilt. He's a great pro, but he's not a "principal" player (albeit far more than I am).
I don't know if the person is referring to Michael Sachs, but one time I put a horn up for sale and he reached out to me. I ended up selling it to somebody else, but clearly he was lurking around. I have also had contact with then principal of Seattle Symphony, who I am afraid to admit that I have forgotten his name. I've also had dealings with members of the Met Opera trumpet section. They definitely are around but they usually don't post much.
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JayKosta
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 24 Dec 2018
Posts: 3349
Location: Endwell NY USA
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| Posted: Tue Sep 13, 2022 5:13 am Post subject: |
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The 'problem' with posting is that it exposes a person to being questioned about it - even if the post is just an 'in my opinion' type.
e.g. what is the justification? what else have you tried? what do those words really mean? etc.
Some people are willing to become engaged in such discussions, but others aren't.
_________________
Most Important Note ? - the next one !
KNOW (see) what the next note is BEFORE you have to play it.
PLAY the next note 'on time' and 'in rhythm'.
Oh ya, watch the conductor - they set what is 'on time'. |
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blbaumgarn
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 26 Jul 2017
Posts: 705
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| Posted: Tue Sep 13, 2022 9:43 pm Post subject: Why Few Professionals on TH? |
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To kind of answer Kehaulani I found TH by accident and was always an amateur with a keen interest in brass music. I have found over the years that reading recollections by yourself, or Tony Scodwell, to name a couple of you teach me about the history of a whole faction of brass players. there are people sharing here that have encyclopedic knowledge of their field. Reading things in TH has enriched my life. Thank you all.
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"There are two sides to a trumpeter's personality,
there is one that lives to lay waste to woodwinds and strings, leaving them lie blue and lifeless along a swath of destruction that is a
trumpeter's fury-then there is the dark side!" Irving Bush |
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MrClean
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 27 Feb 2003
Posts: 2734
Location: Los Angeles
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| Posted: Sat Sep 17, 2022 10:08 pm Post subject: |
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Trolls. Time and time again pros have been driven off by anonymous keyboard warriors. There is no winning something like that when you get sucked into that vortex Most of us decided it’s not worth the aggravation.
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LA Philharmonic
Colburn School
Last edited by MrClean on Sun Sep 18, 2022 11:27 am; edited 2 times in total |
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kehaulani
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 23 Mar 2003
Posts: 9100
Location: Hawai`i - Texas
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| Posted: Sun Sep 18, 2022 9:58 am Post subject: |
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Can't get a more authoritative source than that.
_________________
"If you don't live it, it won't come out of your horn." Bird
"I wouldn't play like Wynton Marsalis even if I could play like Wynton Marsalis." Attributed to Chet
Yamaha 8310Z Bobby Shew trumpet
Benge 3X Trumpet
Benge 3X Cornet |
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dschwab
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 06 Sep 2004
Posts: 520
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| Posted: Fri Sep 23, 2022 6:11 am Post subject: |
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| MrClean wrote: | | Trolls. Time and time again pros have been driven off by anonymous keyboard warriors. There is no winning something like that when you get sucked into that vortex Most of us decided it’s not worth the aggravation. |
The above from MrClean, and it's rather boring to read posts that ask "what mouthpiece should I play," or "is this a good horn," or "how do i play high," or my favorite, "who is the best trumpet player in the world?"
The answer to most questions is posted is:
Listen to as much music as you can.
Practice consistently and for many long hours.
I might check in once a week to see if someone has a question about Broadway, as that's really the only area I'm qualified to comment on.
I rarely post, because people would rather hear about some quick fix or new miracle horn/mouthpiece than, "go practice." |
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Shark01
Veteran Member
Joined: 10 Jun 2017
Posts: 287
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| Posted: Mon Oct 17, 2022 11:47 am Post subject: |
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| LaTrompeta wrote: | | bamajazzlady wrote: | | Shark01 wrote: | | I know of a principal player of a major US orchestra that at least lurks regularly. When I posted I was looking for a particular instrument, he reached out and sold me his…..and let me tell you, the guy knows how to pick great trumpets. |
Is it “MrClean” ? |
It's well known that MrClean is Jim Wilt. He's a great pro, but he's not a "principal" player (albeit far more than I am).
I don't know if the person is referring to Michael Sachs, but one time I put a horn up for sale and he reached out to me. I ended up selling it to somebody else, but clearly he was lurking around. I have also had contact with then principal of Seattle Symphony, who I am afraid to admit that I have forgotten his name. I've also had dealings with members of the Met Opera trumpet section. They definitely are around but they usually don't post much. |
Neither name mentioned here. |
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INTJ
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 25 Dec 2002
Posts: 1986
Location: Northern Idaho
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| Posted: Sun Oct 30, 2022 5:15 pm Post subject: |
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I am not a pro but have been on TH for 20 years. I used to be very active here but over the last several years I have come and gone with big gaps between my postings. I don't do Facebook, Instagram, or Twitter; so an forum is about the only place I can talk trumpet.
I think what causes me to leave for a while is I'll be in a discussion and it goes sideways. Someone is always going to take things in the worst way, and I am just not interested in the drama. Maybe our dearly departed Pros run into the same issue?
What usually brings me back is my enthusiasm for trumpet is re-energized and I want to talk trumpet. However, without fail, if I look up my last interaction and see where it went sideways, I lose enthusiasm.
Maybe it's worth pushing through that. I see several posters who appear to be good guys that keep things going. I could be part of that, but to do so means I'd have to put up with drama every now and then.
Interestingly, I am a pro in a couple of things. I have been a pro pilot for many years--most in the USAF, but I don't post on any aviation forums anymore. Again, there is just too much emotion and drama and working though that is not enjoyable for me.
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