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BADBOY-DON
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 10 Feb 2002
Posts: 2025
Location: EXILED IN GIG HARBOR WA.
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 Posted: Fri Feb 15, 2002 1:14 pm Post subject: |
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Today at lunch, while trying to find more info on the beautiful Rex William Stewart 1907-1967 story, I ran across a few close-up photos of Cooties most radical lips placement on his mouthpiece THAT COMPLETELY ASTOUNDED ME! I CAN NOT EVER REMEMBER OF EVER SEEING SUCH A DIFFERENT AND RADICAL LIP TO MOUTHPIECE PLACEMENT???? GADS! COOTIE MUST HAVE BEEN ABLE TO WITHSTAND HORRIFIC AMOUNT OF PAIN???? OUCH!!!!!
After looking at all 6 photos....A FEW SHOTS...ONE WOULD SWEAR HE LITTERALLY HAS THE LOWER HALF OF HIS MP. "INSIDE OF HIS MOUTH??
The lower jaw looks open...(you can almost see the teeth prints showing through his lower lip that is stretched to almost the rippin' point.
I can not see any of the red part of his lower lip which is SOMEWHERE DEEP WITH IN HIS OPENED MOUTH.
The complete lower part of the mouthpiece rim is totally hidden from veiw and only a very small portion of his upper lip in on the cup...OUCH!!!
CAN ANYONE EXPLAIN WHAT I AM SEEING????...
MANY PLAYERS THINK THAT "SUPER-CHOPS" IS RADICAL...After looking at these close ups..they "TAINT' SEED'NUTTIN' YET????.THIS TAKES THE BRASS-CAKE OFF UNORTHODOX CHOPS PLACEMENT...TALK ABOUT----
"SUPERMEGA-CHOPS!" |
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Ronnie
Regular Member
Joined: 08 Nov 2001
Posts: 87
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| Posted: Fri Feb 15, 2002 1:50 pm Post subject: |
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Well Don - To each his own, I guess. Cootie sounded darned good though, whatever he was doing with his horn. 
Where did you see the pictures? Are they on a website?
Ronnie (hey, remember me from trumpetjazz.com, I think KC is here a lot now too). |
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BADBOY-DON
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 10 Feb 2002
Posts: 2025
Location: EXILED IN GIG HARBOR WA.
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| Posted: Fri Feb 15, 2002 5:20 pm Post subject: |
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On 2002-02-15 16:50, Ronnie wrote:
Well Don - To each his own, I guess. Cootie sounded darned good though, whatever he was doing with his horn.
Where did you see the pictures? Are they on a website?
Ronnie (hey, remember me from trumpetjazz.com, I think KC is here a lot now too).
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Good to see your post again...Tell me whats on your CD table today...and what-music are you working on???? Have you noticed how much trouble I get my butt into on this board???
YOU ARE RIGHT ON ABOUT THE MIGHTY 'COOTIE"????WHAT A TALENT...AND A GIFT! TO OUR JAZZSBROS... |
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Larry Smithee
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 11 Nov 2001
Posts: 4399
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| Posted: Fri Feb 15, 2002 6:32 pm Post subject: |
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Yeah, Cootie was something of an individualist when it came to his embouchure. Bottom line though, like Dizzy, is that it worked for him. There is probably a lesson in there somewhere for many of us. Imagine what kind of advice he might have received if he had visited these web pages?
Larry Smithee |
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BADBOY-DON
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 10 Feb 2002
Posts: 2025
Location: EXILED IN GIG HARBOR WA.
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| Posted: Sat Feb 16, 2002 10:03 am Post subject: |
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On 2002-02-15 21:32, Larry Smithee wrote:
Yeah, Cootie was something of an individualist when it came to his embouchure. Bottom line though, like Dizzy, is that it worked for him. There is probably a lesson in there somewhere for many of us. Imagine what kind of advice he might have received if he had visited these web pages?
Larry Smithee
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))))) Larry! That cracks me up...)) If he listened to this bored' uuuh board about what kind of embro' to use. Perhaps he would have given up trumpet and switched to oboe!
Claude Gordon once said...he never gave much though to how difficult it was to play the high register or get a big full sound in the lower register and he was just over 6 years old. It wasn't until he was contaminated my bunches of well meaning professional instructors that the trouble started with his sound...and range and it took some serious soul searching to get back to where his body was trying in earnest to TELL HIM WHAT HE NEEDED TO DO!
I do not mean to say that proper instruction isn't necessary, however seeking out help "ONE ON ONE" with a qualified instructor still is "SOUND' (pun-intended) ADVICE...and all that jazz. )) |
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BADBOY-DON
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 10 Feb 2002
Posts: 2025
Location: EXILED IN GIG HARBOR WA.
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| Posted: Sat Feb 16, 2002 10:06 am Post subject: |
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Where did I see these photos....all I did was go to YAHOO search engine and type in
"Cootie Williams" and it gave me bunches of links...with some really interesting photos... |
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cybertrumpet
Veteran Member
Joined: 11 Nov 2001
Posts: 354
Location: True-Blue Schilke Loyalist!!
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| Posted: Sat Feb 16, 2002 11:49 am Post subject: |
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| Cootie did have alot of scarring due to the one hand that he held the trumpet with and the other with the plunger. also, he played with alot of movement in both arms and this would move the piece around on his chops. I know what you mean, that is unreal! Have you ever seen the statue of Louis Armstrong in the Louis Armstrong park in New Orleans? the artist who made the bronze statue even got the scarring on Pops chops exactly like it was.amazing! |
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BADBOY-DON
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 10 Feb 2002
Posts: 2025
Location: EXILED IN GIG HARBOR WA.
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| Posted: Sun Feb 17, 2002 9:11 am Post subject: |
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On 2002-02-16 14:49, cybertrumpet wrote:
Cootie did have alot of scarring due to the one hand that he held the trumpet with and the other with the plunger. also, he played with alot of movement in both arms and this would move the piece around on his chops. I know what you mean, that is unreal! Have you ever seen the statue of Louis Armstrong in the Louis Armstrong park in New Orleans? the artist who made the bronze statue even got the scarring on Pops chops exactly like it was.amazing!
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Hummm??? Even today....I notice that so many of our ICON players of note are getting some pretty ugly looking chops!
Terrence Blanchard...OOOUCH!
Roy Hargrove...(bye the way...to me one of the most IMPROVED PLAYERS ON THE PLANET TODAY!!!
Nicholas Payton...OUCH! His chops make me winch...
but there are exceptions...
WYNTON MARSALIS....hardly a mark!! He must have cast Iron LIPS OF STEEL...) |
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Cozy
Veteran Member
Joined: 07 Dec 2001
Posts: 251
Location: Non-smoky club
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| Posted: Sun Feb 17, 2002 1:48 pm Post subject: |
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I do not know the warmup/warm-down techniques of some of the mentioned players, but Badboy Don's comment, "WYNTON MARSALIS....hardly a mark!! He must have cast Iron LIPS OF STEEL." -- Wynton does follow sound procedures. Doc Severinsen, 74!, still practices properly. I doubt either push or abuse like Coots, Nicholas et al...
...Ward Burton, Dodge, ...Sadler 2nd, just won the Daytona 500. Lotsa wrecks.
google.com found: http://www.jazzvalley.com/musician/cootie.williams -- Click Picture Gallery for more great photos by Gerard Demonchy. Click to enlarge. Hmm, born 1910? Another site: 1908. Died 1985.
Cozy
http://www.cozychops.com
[ This Message was edited by: Cozy on 2002-02-17 17:07 ]
[ This Message was edited by: Cozy on 2002-02-17 17:12 ] |
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BADBOY-DON
Heavyweight Member
Joined: 10 Feb 2002
Posts: 2025
Location: EXILED IN GIG HARBOR WA.
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| Posted: Mon Feb 18, 2002 9:31 am Post subject: |
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COZY....
THANKS thanks for finding those Cootie links...THAT WAS THE site that I had found illustrating the Mighty Cootie..with his wild illustrations...of his inside your mouth, mouthpiece placement. ))
Pretty scarey...huh? JUST TO THINK HOW HORRIFIC...IF COOTIE HAD RELAXED HIS GRIP ON HIS LOWER JAW!!!
What a visual with that old mouthpiece...sticking out, through the back of his throat and out the back of his head...
Just jazzin...OUCH! WHAT A LAME THOUGHT... |
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