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oxleyk Heavyweight Member
Joined: 12 Apr 2006 Posts: 4180
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Posted: Thu Apr 29, 2021 2:35 pm Post subject: |
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Jim, I just got the same HAs a few weeks ago. My audiologist said there isn't a useful setting for trumpet playing. They're simply too loud. Even when playing softly with the HA volume low there is too much distortion.
I have a setting for listening to music. It works for playing guitar but not with trumpet. I just take them out or turn them off when I practice.
Kent |
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cheiden Heavyweight Member
Joined: 28 Sep 2004 Posts: 8921 Location: Orange County, CA
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Posted: Thu Apr 29, 2021 4:31 pm Post subject: |
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At this point I want/need hearing aids for speech. When I get around to getting a pair perhaps I'll pony up the extra $ to get custom-molded, musician-friendly ear plugs. When I need those isn't in the band or orchestra but when I get the call from the rock band. _________________ "I'm an engineer, which means I think I know a whole bunch of stuff I really don't."
Charles J Heiden/So Cal
Bach Strad 180ML43*/43 Bb/Yamaha 731 Flugel/Benge 1X C/Kanstul 920 Picc/Conn 80A Cornet
Bach 3C rim on 1.5C underpart |
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jhatpro Heavyweight Member
Joined: 17 Mar 2002 Posts: 10205 Location: The Land Beyond O'Hare
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Posted: Thu Apr 29, 2021 6:16 pm Post subject: |
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Kent, I’ve been playing all day with them in and they sound great and I haven’t even had my telecare adjustment yet. Maybe your audiologist is a drummer. _________________ Jim Hatfield
"The notes are there - find them.” Mingus
2021 Martinus Geelan Custom
2005 Bach 180-72R
1965 Getzen Eterna Severinsen
1946 Conn Victor
1998 Scodwell flugel
1986 Bach 181 cornet
1954 Conn 80A cornet
2002 Getzen bugle |
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Seymor B Fudd Heavyweight Member
Joined: 17 Oct 2015 Posts: 1476 Location: Sweden
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Posted: Fri Apr 30, 2021 1:53 am Post subject: |
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jhatpro wrote: | Kent, I’ve been playing all day with them in and they sound great and I haven’t even had my telecare adjustment yet. Maybe your audiologist is a drummer. |
Oops! Yes he might be. And consequently deaf _________________ Cornets: mp 143D3/ DW Ultra 1,5 C
Getzen 300 series
Yamaha YCRD2330II
Yamaha YCR6330II
Getzen Eterna Eb
Trumpets:
Yamaha 6335 RC Schilke 14B
King Super 20 Symphony DB (1970)
Selmer Eb/D trumpet (1974) |
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cheiden Heavyweight Member
Joined: 28 Sep 2004 Posts: 8921 Location: Orange County, CA
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Posted: Fri Apr 30, 2021 9:12 am Post subject: |
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Jim,
Any downside yet? I've been dragging my feet on this for years and your post has me thinking about pulling the trigger. The Widex aids sound a little bit too good to be true. As an engineer, I fear that the ultra-low delay might reduce the ability to do much signal processing. Any hint of anything like that?
Like I said earlier my prime interest is in speech discrimination. I can hear people talking mostly because I hear the vowels. But I struggle to make out what they're saying because all the percussive consonants like the Ts and the Ks are really really weak because a lot of that sound happens at around 2KHz where my hearing is worst. Any sense that the Widex aids help in this area?
And thanks for sharing all this. It's much appreciated.
Charles _________________ "I'm an engineer, which means I think I know a whole bunch of stuff I really don't."
Charles J Heiden/So Cal
Bach Strad 180ML43*/43 Bb/Yamaha 731 Flugel/Benge 1X C/Kanstul 920 Picc/Conn 80A Cornet
Bach 3C rim on 1.5C underpart |
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djpearlman Veteran Member
Joined: 30 Aug 2002 Posts: 461 Location: Santa Fe, New Mexico
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Posted: Fri Apr 30, 2021 9:44 am Post subject: |
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cheiden wrote: | I struggle to make out what they're saying because all the percussive consonants like the Ts and the Ks are really really weak because a lot of that sound happens at around 2KHz where my hearing is worst. Any sense that the Widex aids help in this area? |
Charles - I got Widex hearing aids - They help immeasurably with understanding speech. There are a wide variety of ear-tips, many of which or "open" leaving the ambient sound untouched while the aid amplifies high-end sounds and allows understanding of words as well as better hearing of musical transients, the high end of piano, etc. They have buttons on the earpeices which allow me to adjust the aid volume up and down, so I can turn them down (or off) when the music around me is loud. _________________ Dan Pearlman
Santa Fe, NM
- Monette Cornette
- Andalusia Cornet
- Carolbrass Pocket Trumpet
- Monette mouthpieces
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC5NafoVeXrsRm-fOhKaIpnA |
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jhatpro Heavyweight Member
Joined: 17 Mar 2002 Posts: 10205 Location: The Land Beyond O'Hare
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Posted: Fri Apr 30, 2021 10:44 am Post subject: |
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Hey guys,
I've been wearing mine for two days and really like them. Hearing more better of everything!
I keep them in when I'm playing my horn and so far I'm impressed but I'm also honeymoon effect prone as in "this mouthpiece is the one!"
I have an online "telecare" session today at which an audiologist will help me adjust them. I'll keep you posted. _________________ Jim Hatfield
"The notes are there - find them.” Mingus
2021 Martinus Geelan Custom
2005 Bach 180-72R
1965 Getzen Eterna Severinsen
1946 Conn Victor
1998 Scodwell flugel
1986 Bach 181 cornet
1954 Conn 80A cornet
2002 Getzen bugle |
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oxleyk Heavyweight Member
Joined: 12 Apr 2006 Posts: 4180
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Posted: Fri Apr 30, 2021 1:56 pm Post subject: |
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jhatpro wrote: | Kent, I’ve been playing all day with them in and they sound great and I haven’t even had my telecare adjustment yet. Maybe your audiologist is a drummer. |
Actually he's a guitarist -- keeps a Telecaster in his office. He's very familiar with the needs of musicians.
Everyone's hearing level will be different. I've tried practicing with my aids in and it just doesn't work for me.
Kent |
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jhatpro Heavyweight Member
Joined: 17 Mar 2002 Posts: 10205 Location: The Land Beyond O'Hare
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Posted: Fri Apr 30, 2021 2:33 pm Post subject: |
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Just had a very impressive online with a licensed/certified audiologist with reformhearing.com who wears Widex himself. He's a member of a professional association and president of a state-wide hearing loss organization.
We were connected Zoom-like via my iPhone and a remote link provided as part of the $3,000 package which includes HA's, accessories and four months of telecare sessions if desired.
He spent half an hour testing my hearing with the HA's in and and tweaking them. He said the only thing that can't be done online is real ear verification which is often recommended but not required unless a patient is having difficulty with their HA's.
In every way the session was like those I've had at brick and mortar audiology services except I didn't have to find a place to park and sit in the waiting room.
Bottom line, I love my Widex 440's. Played my horns a lot this morning. No problems. Also played nine holes in windy conditions with no issues. In fact I heard people shouting fore! a fairway away. _________________ Jim Hatfield
"The notes are there - find them.” Mingus
2021 Martinus Geelan Custom
2005 Bach 180-72R
1965 Getzen Eterna Severinsen
1946 Conn Victor
1998 Scodwell flugel
1986 Bach 181 cornet
1954 Conn 80A cornet
2002 Getzen bugle |
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cheiden Heavyweight Member
Joined: 28 Sep 2004 Posts: 8921 Location: Orange County, CA
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Posted: Fri Apr 30, 2021 4:04 pm Post subject: |
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I've emailed Widex about a free trial. I'm cautiously optimistic now and probably would have avoided it for a good while longer if it weren't for this community here. Thanks guys. _________________ "I'm an engineer, which means I think I know a whole bunch of stuff I really don't."
Charles J Heiden/So Cal
Bach Strad 180ML43*/43 Bb/Yamaha 731 Flugel/Benge 1X C/Kanstul 920 Picc/Conn 80A Cornet
Bach 3C rim on 1.5C underpart |
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jhatpro Heavyweight Member
Joined: 17 Mar 2002 Posts: 10205 Location: The Land Beyond O'Hare
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Posted: Wed May 05, 2021 8:56 am Post subject: |
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Alas, my hearing aid honeymoon has ended. Turns out Kent, who likes his Widex instruments but says he can't use them when he plays, is right. I thought my new Widex Moment pair would enable me to hear and play at the same time but there really is too much distortion.
But they sure are great in other settings. Attended a gathering of a dozen vaccinated folks the other night and I could hear every word! _________________ Jim Hatfield
"The notes are there - find them.” Mingus
2021 Martinus Geelan Custom
2005 Bach 180-72R
1965 Getzen Eterna Severinsen
1946 Conn Victor
1998 Scodwell flugel
1986 Bach 181 cornet
1954 Conn 80A cornet
2002 Getzen bugle |
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stumac Heavyweight Member
Joined: 19 Nov 2008 Posts: 697 Location: Melbourne, Australia
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Posted: Wed May 05, 2021 2:39 pm Post subject: |
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After years of badgering by my wife I went to the audiologist, after a very extensive hearing test she fitted me with a pair of Bernafon Viron BTE 105 aids, these are incredible, hearing sounds I nave not heard for many years.
I have no problems practicing with them, playing in a 18 piece Big Band and 60 piece Symphony Orchestra except when the piccolo has a solo, taking the volume down 1 step fixes this.
My hearing test showed a roll off at 1 kilohertz and 90 db down at 3 kilohertz.
Regards, Stuart. |
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cheiden Heavyweight Member
Joined: 28 Sep 2004 Posts: 8921 Location: Orange County, CA
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Posted: Thu May 06, 2021 12:30 pm Post subject: |
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I'm seeing my audiologist in a few hours and will be discussing the Widex Moments mentioned here. _________________ "I'm an engineer, which means I think I know a whole bunch of stuff I really don't."
Charles J Heiden/So Cal
Bach Strad 180ML43*/43 Bb/Yamaha 731 Flugel/Benge 1X C/Kanstul 920 Picc/Conn 80A Cornet
Bach 3C rim on 1.5C underpart |
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cheiden Heavyweight Member
Joined: 28 Sep 2004 Posts: 8921 Location: Orange County, CA
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Posted: Fri May 07, 2021 8:41 am Post subject: |
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Yesterday I got evaluated and tried a pair of Widex Moment 440's. Testing confirmed that my hearing up to around 1kHz was just out of the normal range but from 1 to 2kHZ my sensitivity sloped down precipitously and was much diminished from there up. The audiologist fit my trial set to allow significant natural unamplified sound then programmed the devices mostly just to supplement my higher frequencies. For the first time in decades I could hear consonants. Pretty cool.
Given my diagnosis and my priorities, the audiologist said that the Widex would probably be my best bet.
I'm very likely to buy a set but there's a big cost range ($4 - 6.7K) based on features I can't be sure I'll need or appreciate. Also my insurance only covers a percentage of aids up to $5K, anything over that would be out-of-pocket. I also made the rookie mistake of going to a provider that was out of network which would raise my out-of-pocket considerably so I'll likely need to find another provider that's in-plan. _________________ "I'm an engineer, which means I think I know a whole bunch of stuff I really don't."
Charles J Heiden/So Cal
Bach Strad 180ML43*/43 Bb/Yamaha 731 Flugel/Benge 1X C/Kanstul 920 Picc/Conn 80A Cornet
Bach 3C rim on 1.5C underpart
Last edited by cheiden on Mon Jan 10, 2022 9:24 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Seymor B Fudd Heavyweight Member
Joined: 17 Oct 2015 Posts: 1476 Location: Sweden
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Posted: Sat May 08, 2021 2:48 am Post subject: |
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cheiden wrote: | Yesterday I got evaluated and dried a pair of Widex Moment 440's. Testing confirmed that my hearing up to around 1kHz was just out of the normal range but from 1 to 2kHZ my sensitivity sloped down precipitously and was much diminished from there up. The audiologist fit my trial set to allow significant natural unamplified sound then programmed the devices mostly just to supplement my higher frequencies. For the first time in decades I could hear consonants. Pretty cool.
Given my diagnosis and my priorities, the audiologist said that the Widex would probably be my best bet.
I'm very likely to buy a set but there's a big cost range ($4 - 6.7K) based on features I can't be sure I'll need or appreciate. Also my insurance only covers a percentage of aids up to $5K, anything over that would be out-of-pocket. I also made the rookie mistake of going to a provider that was out of network which would raise my out-of-pocket considerably so I'll likely need to find another provider that's in-plan. |
Turns out that my previous hearing aids was a couple of Widex. My hearing profile matches yours almost exactly.
I was never comfortable with the Widexes; despite there was this 'musical' mode I found them downright irritating. High frequences travelled straight ahead - so I felt - into my ears and I found no way to adjust this. As I wrote above this sometimes ended up in an "automatic" too hasty response to something my wife told me...her voice seemed angry - but wasn´t....
My present equipment are a pair of Oticons, S3, Minirite; total cost converted to US currency 740 USD. This including the charger.
These hearing aids feature the possibility of raising (and lowering) the amplifying, a 'musical´mode and - a comfort mode (lowers the risk of argueing with you know....). The ability to amplify more comes in handy watching the TV - general volume of the TVset "normal" but you can make your own adjustment by using the cellphone app.
But - I never use them when playing! I have grown accustomed always measuring the sound levels of concerts, and what not (also by an app - Decibel X). Has become a ritual - maybe carrying things too far - but I want to keep the remains of my hearing as intact as possible... _________________ Cornets: mp 143D3/ DW Ultra 1,5 C
Getzen 300 series
Yamaha YCRD2330II
Yamaha YCR6330II
Getzen Eterna Eb
Trumpets:
Yamaha 6335 RC Schilke 14B
King Super 20 Symphony DB (1970)
Selmer Eb/D trumpet (1974) |
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CTeneyck Regular Member
Joined: 23 Dec 2001 Posts: 80 Location: Framingham, MA
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Posted: Sat May 08, 2021 5:45 am Post subject: |
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Hi all,
A good thread here.
I have a new set of oticons which I need for upper frequencies. They are a big improvement over my 5+ year old pair - much better with hearing birdsong, etc and making others' talking more comprehensible. The trumpet overwhelms them but they can be turned town when I'm practicing. I'm looking forward to using them within an orchestra - we have an outdoor event coming in June so I'll know more then. They are expensive - $5k for the pair and my insurance covered $1k They can be controlled with a cellphone app but that really runs down the phone batter so I use the rocker switches on the units themselves. The more expensive cellphones can also funnel phone output into the earpieces which would be fun, but my cheap android doesn't support that.
When I was first getting them (I guess around 15 years ago) I first tried a widex pair, but they'd click every time I tongued a note, so then move to the (more expensive - naturally!) oticons. The improvement between the old version and the new is extensive - the sound intake is much broader.
I opted to continue working with the audiology group I like, so I know I paid a premium for that. Audiology shops (in my experience) will give you a trial, so I urge everyone to check it out and at least get your hearing tested if you're having trouble understanding conversation. Make sure you get a copy of your test results so you'll have a baseline for future tests. Health insurance often covers hearing exams.
Hearing loss is a sneaky thing and most places and people just couldn't care less (movie theater previews for example -- although you can at least get free tickets if you complain sometimes, non-acoustic concerts, etc.) In band situations loud situations are unavoidable.
I find it helps to always have earplugs handy (the foam ones are cheap and comfortable -- one can play with them, but everything is muffled. I like earasers for loud musical situations (beware the timpani!) It's a pain, but hearing loss won't regenerate on its own. You have to protect yourself in all situations - many conductors have no clue either. And of course, being a brass player, I've become a lot more aware of damage I can cause . . . even if I play well
best, Chris |
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Bill_Bumps Veteran Member
Joined: 07 May 2019 Posts: 159
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Posted: Thu Apr 27, 2023 7:07 pm Post subject: |
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jhatpro wrote: | Puzzing over whether a musician wth moderate to severe hearing loss should wear hearing aids or ear plugs in performance, I found this: |
I'm an amateur, but I wear shooters' earmuffs when I practice. I have about a 40% loss, caused by being too close to an explosion when I was younger. Probably many years of unprotected lawn-mowing and snow-blowing didn't help, either. In any case, I wear hearing aids now, and I don't want to make my hearing any worse than it is, so the earmuffs go on as soon as I break out the horn.
If I ever get myself to the point of playing in public venues, I'll wear earplugs. |
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jhatpro Heavyweight Member
Joined: 17 Mar 2002 Posts: 10205 Location: The Land Beyond O'Hare
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Posted: Mon Jan 22, 2024 6:19 am Post subject: |
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Thought I’d restart this thread because I’m trying to find a solution to the problem of hearing in groups. I’ve tried Bernafon, Widex and Resound and they all provide some help but not enough.
My latest hearing test found my loss is “moderate sloping to severe” which suggests I might be expecting to much from over the counter HA’s.
I’m planning to try Oticon which offers a free trial but only in a clinical setting.
Has anyone with my level of loss found a brand/model that helps in groups including parties, restaurants, gigs and rehearsals? _________________ Jim Hatfield
"The notes are there - find them.” Mingus
2021 Martinus Geelan Custom
2005 Bach 180-72R
1965 Getzen Eterna Severinsen
1946 Conn Victor
1998 Scodwell flugel
1986 Bach 181 cornet
1954 Conn 80A cornet
2002 Getzen bugle |
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RandyTX Heavyweight Member
Joined: 25 Mar 2010 Posts: 5299 Location: Central Texas
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Posted: Tue Jan 23, 2024 2:08 pm Post subject: |
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I play in one particular 'horn band' that has two problems in rehearsals.
1) the vocalists never get tired of saying "turn up my monitor"... there is no wattage, or SPL level that is ever sufficient for them to be happy with their volume, no matter how small the rehearsal space might be. Suggestions that pitch would be better if they could hear each other, instead of only themselves, well, that just gets you stared at with a funny, confused look.
2) 2 guitars, both of which think they're playing 'lead' most of the time, and have it turned up to 11 every time the amp is plugged in.
So, I'm fairly sure that most of the hearing damage I've experienced in my entire lifetime was accumulated in rehearsals with that particular band, and gigs with them. I've tried various 'hearing' protection options, none of which are particularly ideal. I sometimes have no choice but to stuff ear plugs in my ears in self-defense, but I find it very difficult to play within a horn section with them on, mainly because I don't sound 'normal' that way, trying to hear the bell's output from within my head, instead of through my ears.
I'd love a noise protection solution that allowed me to still hear how I fit in with the rest of the horn section, as well as hear at least the bass line as well, for pitch/progression reasons. _________________ "Music is like candy, you throw the (w)rappers away." |
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